Forum Transcripts

Point of View Questions 2/3/06

Event start time:

Thu Feb 02 15:07:34 2006

Event end time:

Fri Feb 03 20:47:26 2006



Legend:
Questions from the Audience are presented in red.
Answers by the Speaker are in black.
The Moderator's comments are in blue.

guestspeaker

hi Mary

guestspeaker

Hi Mary

mary rosenblum

Hello all!

mary rosenblum

Welcome to our Friday After Hours Forum.

mary rosenblum

I'm waiting for a BIG Pacific storm to hit, but hopefully it will hold off until we're done here...

mary rosenblum

but if I vanish, that's why. :-)

mary rosenblum

This is our After Hours Forum, with me, Mary Rosenblum, your web editor and we're talking about Point of View. I've published seven novels (number eight will be out next year) , more than 60 short stories, and will do my best to answer any questions you have. If you're new here, remember that you need to click on the 'Ask a Question' button or the 'word bubble' next to the red question mark at the top of the screen in order to ask a question. Your regular 'send' bar won't reach me! Or you can use /ask and type your question into the regular send bar if that works better for you..

mary rosenblum

I thought we'd focus on Point of View tonight...any questions you have about it at all.

mary rosenblum

I know first person, second, and third as well as the various forms of those POVs really...

mary rosenblum

confuse a lot of novice writers.

barbg

Is there a deep third person point of view?

mary rosenblum

Yes, Barb. It is what is called 'deep penetration' or 'zero narrative distance' limited third.

mary rosenblum

It is when you immerse your reader utterly in this character.

mary rosenblum

The reader perceives the story entirely through the POV's senses...

mary rosenblum

that is you hear only sounds she hears, you see only what she sees, you know only what she knows.

mary rosenblum

It is the key ingredient of really powerful characterization.

barbg

So that's a good pov?

mary rosenblum

Depends on what you are doing, barb. It's certainly my favorite, but it may NOT be the best choice all the time.

mary rosenblum

It works very well for character driven stories when you want your reader to identify with the POV character.

mary rosenblum

It may not work as well if your POV is not very likeable...

mary rosenblum

because your reader will resist identifying with that person...

mary rosenblum

or if your story is strongly plot driven and you don't have a strong MC...

mary rosenblum

or where your MC is not going to be present for important events.

paminnapa

would that be like Stephen Kings Misery where we could feel the guys fear?

mary rosenblum

I haven't read Misery but generally, if you begin to feel as if you are living the story with the MC, then that is what the author is doing.

mary rosenblum

This is what all limited third person is supposed to do, but some writers do it more 'deeply' than others.

mary rosenblum

That's why it's called 'limited third'. We are 'limited' to what the POV character perceives.

megger

So is that like the internal monologue in first person?

mary rosenblum

Good for you megger...

mary rosenblum

Actually first person is ALL internal monologue except when the POV speaks out loud. :-)

mary rosenblum

But really deep limited third reads like first person...

mary rosenblum

and often if you ask someone afteward, they may even tell you the story was written in first person.

mary rosenblum

But to get that effect, all the description in the story needs to be in your POV character's voice.

mary rosenblum

The effect is similar to a first person POV telling us what's going on.

mary rosenblum

third person POV also comes in other flavors. :-)

mary rosenblum

You have omnsicient, the novice writer's usual choice (and RARELY a good one)...

mary rosenblum

and cinematic.

mary rosenblum

Oh, let's not forget narrative third...

mary rosenblum

That is when the author TELLS the story...

mary rosenblum

and that can work...Fritz Leiber does it nicely with his Fafhrd and Grey Mouser stories...

mary rosenblum

but it's harder to do well than you might think. And it's also another 'novice third'.

mary rosenblum

For the most part, avoid narrative third and omniscient unless you have GOOD reasons to use 'em.

mary rosenblum

And there are not many good reasons.

paminnapa

can you give a sample of omiscient

mary rosenblum

This is our After Hours Forum, with me, Mary Rosenblum, your web editor and we're talking about Point of View. I've published seven novels (number eight will be out next year) , more than 60 short stories, and will do my best to answer any questions you have. If you're new here, remember that you need to click on the 'Ask a Question' button or the 'word bubble' next to the red question mark at the top of the screen in order to ask a question. Your regular 'send' bar won't reach me! Or you can use /ask and type your question into the regular send bar if that works better for you..

mary rosenblum

Sure, Pam.

mary rosenblum

Tom wandered into the living room. Carla sprawled on the couch, her golden hair sweeping the floor. Gosh, she's gorgeous, he thought. I wonder if I dare ask her out.

mary rosenblum

Carle peeked at him from beneath her hair. Boy, that Tom is sure cute. I hope he asks me out, she thought.

mary rosenblum

Many novices think it's a GREAT pov because wow, your reader now knows everything they need to know!

mary rosenblum

BUT...it prevents you from becoming intimate with any particular character.

mary rosenblum

Every time we 'head hop' from one character to another...we are jolted out of our growing intimacy with that character...

mary rosenblum

and have to start over.

mary rosenblum

Now this CAN work when you have a very plot driven story...

mary rosenblum

and we really never indentify with or become bonded to any particular character.

mary rosenblum

Then we can be distanced and it's fine.

mary rosenblum

But if the reader must care about a character for your story to work, then stay in that character's POV and do not leave!

janecj333

don't you think that most beginning writers who use omniscient don't know what they're doing? it just feels easy?

mary rosenblum

Of course.

mary rosenblum

You do EVERYTHING because you don't know what you're doing at first. :-)

mary rosenblum

And at first you really cannot see the difference. Yeah, you know what moved you as a reader...

mary rosenblum

but you can't point out WHY it moved you.

mary rosenblum

That's what learning your craft is all about.

mary rosenblum

That's why writers are not BORN.

mary rosenblum

You might have a strong gift of story...

mary rosenblum

but you have to learn how to make that story work powerfully for many many different readers.

sayre

can you list some good books for researching POV if you are a novice writer?

mary rosenblum

I think the best one out there is Orson Scott Card's book from Writers Digest Books.

mary rosenblum

Character and Characterization, I think?

mary rosenblum

He taught me how to do it and 'deep penetration third' is a term he made up.

mary rosenblum

He's a very good teacher and his book is very clear.

geezer

So, in deep third can we use "I" ?

mary rosenblum

Geeze, youcan only use 'I" in third person in dialogue.

mary rosenblum

You can create the 'feeling' of it being first, but if you're in third person, you're using he/she or the POV's name.

janecj333

'deep penetration'...sounds very sensual

mary rosenblum

Actually I think that word needs an 'x' in it. :-) I think Scott actually missed that nuance when he used it first.

geezer

Not inner dialogue?

mary rosenblum

Only in direct throught, geeze, not paraphrased thought.

paminnapa

How would you incorporate thought into 3rd person?

mary rosenblum

Caroline peered through the curtain as Tom headed for the barn. Cute. She smiled. Maybe she'd take those horseback riding lessons after all.

mary rosenblum

Cute is Caroline's thought.

mary rosenblum

So is 'Maybe she'd take those horseback riding lessons after all'.

mary rosenblum

Those are not the actual words passing through her brain...

mary rosenblum

we tend to think in fragments and her ACTUAL thought might be...'might do it'...

mary rosenblum

and nothing more than that.

mary rosenblum

Which won't mean much to the reader.

tory

But yopu couldn't say: Maybe I'll take those lessons after all"?

mary rosenblum

Sure.

mary rosenblum

You see that all the time...it is 'direct thought' and often publishers italicize it. (Which I hate).

mary rosenblum

But those thoughts tend to read 'clunky' to the reader...

mary rosenblum

because we rarely think in dialogue.

mary rosenblum

So they sound false.

mary rosenblum

You can use them, but I wouldn't use them often at all.

carla

can you explain second person POV

mary rosenblum

Second person POV is 'YOU'.

mary rosenblum

You go down the hall and peer around the door at your little brother.

mary rosenblum

Jemmy is brushing his teeth and you just have time to go sneak the quarter under his pillow so he'll find it in the morning and..

mary rosenblum

think the tooth fairy left it.

janecj333

can you touch on 2nd person (is that what it's called?) pov...it's a weird one and one I used to see in a lot of sf a few years ago

mary rosenblum

Yeah, it showed up ...when was it? Way back in the eighties, I think. Sort of a 'litrerary phase'...

mary rosenblum

Readers tend to dislike it...the reaction is 'no I did not'...

mary rosenblum

but it can work.

mary rosenblum

I actually have a...lessee...2300 word piece from a writers workshop I'm doing in a couple of weeks...

mary rosenblum

and it's in second person. I haven't read it yet, but I think it's probably satire.

robastor

Many young adult adventure stories used second person, especially in stories where you picked which events happened next.

mary rosenblum

Well, 'many' YA don't use it, but yes, the 'choose your own adventure' books did. :-)

mary rosenblum

They were a hoot, actually.

mary rosenblum

It can work.

mary rosenblum

It works better in a literary piece where you are playing with style...

mary rosenblum

rather than with plot and character.

mary rosenblum

carla try using /ask in front of a longer question in your REGULAR send bar...

mary rosenblum

that will let you send me a longer question.

speckledorf

Evening! The OSC book is Character & ViewPoint...very good. Is one I'm in process of studying now.

mary rosenblum

Thanks Speck! I was going to go google it when I got a second.

carla

so if piece is personal experience article :

carla

whole article is using I and Me.... but when refer to

mary rosenblum

I'm guessing from what you sent that you're asking if it's a personal experience article using first person...

carla

so if a piece is a personal experience article and the whole article is using I and me ... and you make a statement like "if you get my drift" how is that 2nd POV

mary rosenblum

ah, bingo! Thanks.

mary rosenblum

Yes, 'If you get my drift' is you, the author, speaking directly to the reader...

mary rosenblum

and it's fine.

mary rosenblum

It can make a nice personal connection... but the piece is in first person POV...if you're telling about an experience that happened to you.

mary rosenblum

I go fishing with my dad every weekend. It's not like I really l like to fish, but my dad really likes it...

mary rosenblum

that I like to fish, if you get my drift.

mary rosenblum

This is a first person character...could be the author, could be a made up character...talking to the reader.

geezer

So, we can mix inner thought and direct thought?

mary rosenblum

Sure, geeze. Here's an example:

mary rosenblum

Marty grabbed for the vase, winced as it crashed. Lordy. She squeezed her eyes closed. She was in big trouble now.

mary rosenblum

'Lordy' is the word (well probably a much stronger version) that flashes into her mind.

mary rosenblum

It is her actual thought.

mary rosenblum

She was in big trouble now is the paraphrase of what is actually going through her mind...

mary rosenblum

which is probably less coherent.

janecj333

It seems as if omniscient pov reveals everything but the kitchen sink and romance writers tend to use it to make their characters appear naive; 3rd person pov functions to hide info from the reader ( to develop suspense); 1st person can let the narrator lie to the reader which might be important in a mystery. I can't think of a good reason to use 2nd person pov.

mary rosenblum

That's a pretty good summation, Jane.

mary rosenblum

I think the main reason to use 2nd person is to make the reader pay attention to HOW you are writing.

mary rosenblum

As I said, it's predominantly used in literary, stylistically driven, works.

mary rosenblum

It can give a story a weird, dreamlike feel but readers are VERY resistant to it...

mary rosenblum

and many editors won't even look at it.

robastor

What do you call the POV froma secondary character in the sotry, not the hero?

mary rosenblum

POV and Main Character are not the same thing, rob.

mary rosenblum

Scout, in To Kill a Mockingbird, is the POV and she is not the MC.

mary rosenblum

Quite a few books have a main character who is not the POV.

mary rosenblum

Sometimes the POV is the author...that's a narrative story.

xana

Dr. Watson and Sherlock Holmes

mary rosenblum

Good one, Xana.

carla

is most non-fiction done in first person

mary rosenblum

Yes, carla.

mary rosenblum

And there's a reason for that.

mary rosenblum

Even if it is true, if you use third person, the readers feel that it is fiction.

mary rosenblum

They expect 'I' if you are telling us a true story.

mary rosenblum

Some writers use a strong narrative voice to tell a true story about another person...

mary rosenblum

so that their narrative voice reminds the reader 'I am telling this and it's true'.

carla

if is true story in a fiction format do you have to tell it in 1st ... or is it possible to use a different pov

mary rosenblum

If you don't want to use first...say you're telling the story of the kid next door who saves his family from a flood...

mary rosenblum

I would use a narrative third...a 'storytelling voice'...

mary rosenblum

that makes it clear to the reader that you, the author, are telling us about this kid.

mary rosenblum

When you put the reader into the character's head, so to speak, you really are crossing over into the 'fiction' side of the fence.

geezer

It's essential to the plot to know what both the MC & the secondary character is thinking. Is it a good idea to skip a line, go to the secondary charater for one paragraph, and then skip another line to return to the MC?

mary rosenblum

Geezer I will bet you money that I can make the readers guess what your secondary character is thinking without shifting POV. :-)

mary rosenblum

Shifting POV is easy...but it costs you.

mary rosenblum

With a little work you don't have to shift POV.

mary rosenblum

Nobody said writing was easy.

telcontar

what if the MC is blind and can't see the expression and body language of the other?

mary rosenblum

Then you have to find some other way to convey their reactions tel...

mary rosenblum

your MC can be VERY good at reading pauses and rhythms of speech, indrawn breaths...

mary rosenblum

and the like.

mary rosenblum

Or someone says something that gives us a clue.

mary rosenblum

Actually, a blind POV is a fun challenge.

mary rosenblum

I did it once.

mary rosenblum

Spent a day without seeing and had a good friend who had been totally blind since 16...she had GREAT insights.

mary rosenblum

She could tell if a room was empty or full, if people were present.

mary rosenblum

COOL stuff.

mary rosenblum

This is our After Hours Forum, with me, Mary Rosenblum, your web editor and we're talking about Point of View. I've published seven novels (number eight will be out next year) , more than 60 short stories, and will do my best to answer any questions you have. If you're new here, remember that you need to click on the 'Ask a Question' button or the 'word bubble' next to the red question mark at the top of the screen in order to ask a question. Your regular 'send' bar won't reach me! Or you can use /ask and type your question into the regular send bar if that works better for you..

mary rosenblum

Geeze, think of this...

mary rosenblum

Your secondary character can reveal info through body language...

mary rosenblum

she can start a sentence and shut up...giving us a clue that the MC might miss, if you need to leave the MC in the dark.

mary rosenblum

Your secondary can say something cryptic which our MC misses and readers do not.

mary rosenblum

Your MC can guess what she's withholding and then decide that can't be.

mary rosenblum

WE know it is.

mary rosenblum

Now, it's not like you can't EVER shift POV in a short story.

mary rosenblum

yes, the cost is high if your story is character driven...

mary rosenblum

that is, if the success of your story depends on we readers bonding with and caring about a character.

mary rosenblum

It will diminish your story's success a bit.

mary rosenblum

BUT...if the story is more plot driven...it's the twist end that matters...

mary rosenblum

or the solution of the mystery...then yeah, you can shift POV...

mary rosenblum

if we aren't deeply involved with your MC>

mary rosenblum

But do it because it benefits the story, not because it's easier.

mary rosenblum

Most novices do it because it's easy, it seems like the simplest solution (it is) and don't realize what price they pay.

mary rosenblum

If your story is strongly plot driven, that shift in POV might be just fine.

geezer

I'm doing a novel. Does that make a difference?

mary rosenblum

Goodness yes. I'm laughing.

mary rosenblum

Most novels have more than one POV character.

mary rosenblum

It's hard to stick to a single POV for an entire novel and it does limit you.

mary rosenblum

I tend to think of 'short story' when someone say story...I need to ask 'how long'!

geezer

But don't shift within a scene

mary rosenblum

Exactly...you'd be amazed how many readers will miss it.

owlybear

Hi Mary... I'm writing a true story about a girl who was raped by four men.. a week later she was shot in the face with a shotgun by a stepbrother of one of the rapists... he was sentenced to 7 years for attempted murder but for 24 years the victim lived in fear until his death... her female cousin stuck by her all those years... I want to express the fear that the victim had as well as the reaction of the cousin to that fear for so many years... I want to do it in story form but is it difficult to have two POVs... it's for my lesson 12 (finally) and I want to sell it to interested magazines....so I want to do an excellent job...

mary rosenblum

Owly, I would do that as a narrative...you're telling the story, and just use good, vivid description when you want readers to share that fear.

mary rosenblum

This is a type of story where you can shift POV...just make it clear to the reader when you do so.

telcontar

the only story I've ever read that successfully jumps between POVs was The Blue Sword by Robin McKinley

mary rosenblum

Short story, tel?

telcontar

no... novel

mary rosenblum

I've read quite a few novel with more than one strong POV.

mary rosenblum

Actually, when you get into the thriller genre, you generally have a relatively large number...

mary rosenblum

I just read one ...I'm on an award committe and playing judge...and I think it had four serious POV.

mary rosenblum

No...make that five.

janecj333

isn't multiple pov in novels a pretty recent innovation, though? I'm thinking of the classics

mary rosenblum

As I recall, jane, a lot of those classics are more omniscient than limited third.

mary rosenblum

I think it's the limited third that's a fairly recent innovation.

mary rosenblum

And you have a lot more narrative in the classics like Dickens Austin and the like.

janecj333

I've read, in fact, that the novel is a fairly new artform, and most writing was epic myth, religious dogma, and letters in centuries past

mary rosenblum

Oh yes.

mary rosenblum

NOvel didn't appear until...I think 1800s but anyone with a more precise date feel free to toss it up here.

mary rosenblum

This is our After Hours Forum, with me, Mary Rosenblum, your web editor and we're talking about Point of View. I've published seven novels (number eight will be out next year) , more than 60 short stories, and will do my best to answer any questions you have. If you're new here, remember that you need to click on the 'Ask a Question' button or the 'word bubble' next to the red question mark at the top of the screen in order to ask a question. Your regular 'send' bar won't reach me! Or you can use /ask and type your question into the regular send bar if that works better for you..

mary rosenblum

One rule of thumb for POV...

mary rosenblum

is that the more the character drives the story, the deeper your POV needs to be.

janecj333

Makes you wonder what innovation will come next, and why we didn't think of it first! :)

mary rosenblum

Ah, this is the stuff of many late night conversations in the bar at writers' conferences, jane. :-)

carla

is still trying to get non fiction pov down ... so if writing something like "For the most part, courtships is crude among lizards. During the breeding season males chase females, and when the female is caught, mating follows." is this still 1st person POV

mary rosenblum

When you're writing this type of highly informative nonfiction, carla...

mary rosenblum

you are using a very very distanced third person. You avoid any personal reference at all...

mary rosenblum

In nonfiction, 'I' and first person finds a home in 'personal narrative'.

mary rosenblum

That's what the name means...you the author are talking to us.

mary rosenblum

Informative pieces use a distanced third with no hint of author as person.

mary rosenblum

It conveys the information clearly, that's all.

mary rosenblum

Medical writing is a different form from that and uses predominantly passive voice.

mary rosenblum

But that is a VERY specialized field and if you're not in research you're not going to use it.

carla

so if change it to "For the most part, if you watch the courtship of lizards, you will find it crude." then it would be 1st person

mary rosenblum

No, first person is 'I'.

mary rosenblum

What you have here is a narrative third...you the author are speaking to the reader...

mary rosenblum

this is more personal than the distanced third you'd find in, say, a textbook on reptiles.

mary rosenblum

This might work for, say, a family magazine.

carla

groans

mary rosenblum

The thing to do, Carla, is pick up a copy of the magazine you want to sell to...

mary rosenblum

and read it.

mary rosenblum

Pay attention to how the articles are written.

mary rosenblum

Does an author use 'you' like that and speak directly to the reader?

mary rosenblum

Or are all the articles more impersonal...

mary rosenblum

For the most part, the courtship of lizards seems crude.

mary rosenblum

That's a more distanced, less personal third.

mary rosenblum

You're not speaking to the reader.

tory

What differentiates run-of-the-mill third from deep third POV?

mary rosenblum

It entirely depends on where you have to stand to see what is begin described, tory.

mary rosenblum

If we see the entire scene then this is a relatively distanced third person.

mary rosenblum

If we only see what the POV character sees, then this is a very limited third.

mary rosenblum

If you take our article on lizard mating...

mary rosenblum

this is also third person but we're not trying to convey anybody's personal thoughts here!

mary rosenblum

We're just describing lizard behavior...characterization is not going to play any role in this piece.

tory

So deep third and limited third refer to the same thing?

mary rosenblum

Yes. Limited third is the term everybody...pretty much...agrees on.

mary rosenblum

It means that you are 'limited' to what the POV character knows, hears, sees, tastes, smells, feels.

mary rosenblum

It seems confusing when we take it out of the story and dissect it like this...

mary rosenblum

but you're already doing it on the page. :-)

mary rosenblum

One way to 'check' your POV...

mary rosenblum

is to read your scene.

mary rosenblum

Ask yourself where someone has to stand in order to see everything you describe in the scene.

speckledorf

The OSC book goes in to deep third and shows some really great examples. Makes it easy to understand.

mary rosenblum

Yes. He does a good job of making it clear.

mary rosenblum

I really recommend that book.

mary rosenblum

Character and viewpoint

mary rosenblum

That's the link to the amazon.com page for the book

mary rosenblum

He was writing it when I worked with him and I have a set of page proofs of it.

carla

thank you Mary ... night A/all needs be up at 5 to drive for first interview assigned

mary rosenblum

Good luck on your interview, Carla.

mary rosenblum

Is this for an assignment or an article?

info

OSC is Orson Scott Card, right?

mary rosenblum

Sorry, yes.

mary rosenblum

Mastering really limited POV will give your characters much greater depth...

mary rosenblum

since it will allow readers to share the story with that character.

mary rosenblum

It is one of your strongest characterization tools.

mary rosenblum

You can, of course, share a lot with the reader in first person...

mary rosenblum

but the limitation there is that the first person character is always telling the reader...

mary rosenblum

so the reader never really merges with that character as can happen in limited third.

janecj333

can you give us a short laundry list of pov no-no's that editors will dock you for, especially in a novel?

mary rosenblum

I don't really think there is any technique that will get you 'docked' jane, except for using second person (you)!

mary rosenblum

The technique has to work in that particular story.

mary rosenblum

And if it does, it's fine.

mary rosenblum

If it does not...THAT will cost you.

mary rosenblum

Not the technique itself but the fact that the story suffered because of it.

tory

In novel length, if you shift from one POV to another, but the time doesn't change, should you still leave extra space and mark it?

mary rosenblum

It is difficult to shift from one POV into another within the same time and place without losing readers.

mary rosenblum

That skipped line is problematic...

mary rosenblum

because readers may think the time or place have changed.

mary rosenblum

If you must do that shift, try to use the new POV's name right away so the reader gets a heads up.

mary rosenblum

Say we've been in Sue's POV up until now.

mary rosenblum

And you decide to shift into Brent's POV.

mary rosenblum

THis is how I would start.

mary rosenblum

Brent turned and looked at the grandfather clock in the corner. Only ten minutes? It seemed as if he'd been here an hour.

mary rosenblum

At least, by using Brent's name first in the sentence, the reader gets a tap on the shoulder '(Hey, buddy, the POV has changed)

tory

I tried once to add some suspense by saying: She didn't know her life would turn 180 degrees that night. They didn't like that! Author's POV, not characters.

mary rosenblum

Yep.

tory

In your Brent/Sue ex. You woul not leave extra space then?

mary rosenblum

I probably would not. I have done the inscene switch in novels where I needed to shift POV and didn't want a four page chapter!

mary rosenblum

I do something like I did with the Brent/sue example.

mary rosenblum

A skipped line is even more obtrusive.

mary rosenblum

Most readers make the switch. The ones that dont' grumble about it at the next book signing, sigh.

mary rosenblum

Readers DO tell you what does not work. How did you think I foiund out anyway? LOL

janecj333

I have seen authors tell a scene from one pov, and then retell the same event immediately after in a second pov. The repeat slows the action too much for me.

mary rosenblum

Yeah, it's a cool device, but like you, I always find that it slows the story too much.

mary rosenblum

I'd like to find a way to make that work though.

janecj333

A novel with multiple pov where the mc is in the first scene, but then disappears for several scenes while we meet other pov characters, might be a problem for editors, am I right?

mary rosenblum

I could be a problem for readers, Jane, if they don't realize your MC is the MC.

mary rosenblum

It can work if you have either dual MCs or a very strong secondary...

mary rosenblum

so that the MC gradually takes over the story from the secondary or the other MC

ltsonya

so if you have several POV characters, how would you go about showing that this particular one is the MC?

mary rosenblum

YOur MC is the person with the 'most on the table'.

mary rosenblum

This is the person who will be affected most by the story.

mary rosenblum

When I started out, I published several stories that had a different character as MC in the first draft...

mary rosenblum

and only later realized that it was THIS character's story.

mary rosenblum

I never would have published them with the original MC.

mary rosenblum

Your MC has the most at stake and is most involved with what is going on.

telcontar

what about a novel about an entire family during a war.... with the POV resting on each of the people at some point in the book. There isn't really an MC. It's about the war and how it affects the family

mary rosenblum

You put your finger on it, tel...

mary rosenblum

the family and the war is the MC in effect...in other words this is a plot/setting driven story...

mary rosenblum

and the characters support it.

geezer

Hoa about introducing characters in suceeding chapters and not getting back to MC until the 4th one?

mary rosenblum

Well, that's a long gap right off the bat, geeze.

mary rosenblum

I'd try to get back to your MC sooner than that.

megger

You could retell a scene from another POV in a dream - you could really show some creativity.

mary rosenblum

It should be doable. I actually did it in two different stories. :-)

mary rosenblum

The same scene occurs in both...one as an actual scene, in the other story, it's the MC's memory.

mary rosenblum

A bunch of fans DID make the connection. That was my little hidden reader cookie for attentive readers. It was fun.

mary rosenblum

Well, this has been a fun Oregon hour...

mary rosenblum

and our storm has not yet hit.

mary rosenblum

Do join us on Sunday for our casual chat...

mary rosenblum

same time as this..but we just talk about whatever.

mary rosenblum

I'll see you all then!

mary rosenblum

And I'll post the transcript in the usual place.

mary rosenblum

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